[jtgrenier]

I was wondering.... how many of you practice rev matching when you downshift on your bikes? I know it isn't an essential unless you're tracking, but I love the exhaust note and it theoretically minimizes the wear on the clutch.

Plus it makes riding the twisties that much more fun

Thoughts?

 

[Felix]

I used to, saves locking up the rear Now with the slipper clutch it's all good

Plus most of my down shifting happens after 150mph and is pretty subtle Upshifts are where I need the magic

Felix

 

[CoinSlot]

Thoughts?

If you're talking about: Clutch in, blip throttle, cluth out. No, I don't. Not worth the energy of moving my hand.

If you're talking about: Downward pressure on shifter, blip throttle, box slips down a gear. Yes, everyday.

Using the clutch and blipping is a bit of an oxymoron, no?


If the sound is what you like, clutchless downshifting under heavy braking is pure orgasm. I've been meaning to properly record my exhaust note while on the road. The pops and rumbles make me happy in the pants.

 

[jtgrenier]

If you're talking about: Clutch in, blip throttle, cluth out. No, I don't. Not worth the energy of moving my hand.

If you're talking about: Downward pressure on shifter, blip throttle, box slips down a gear. Yes, everyday.

Using the clutch and blipping is a bit of an oxymoron, no?


If the sound is what you like, clutchless downshifting under heavy braking is pure orgasm. I've been meaning to properly record my exhaust note while on the road. The pops and rumbles make me happy in the pants.

I didn't know you could do it without using the clutch? At least not without breaking something... The way I do it is the same technique I know people use in manual transmission cars. The point of blipping AND pulling in the clutch is to minimize the work of synchronizing the gears (I might be describing this wrong), thus allowing a longer clutch life.

I don't do it primarily because for sound. But it's a nice perk. I try to avoid heavy braking if I can...

 

[CoinSlot]

You have much to learn, young Skywalker.

Bikes and cars have a different style of gearbox. I'm pretty much just regurgitating what I've been told. Sequential boxes are made for (almost) no clutch usage.

I use mine for 1 to 2 and 2 to 1 but hardly ever for any other shift (and if I'm really twisting the wrist, clutchless every shift). If you're worried about clutch wear then using the clutch is the opposite of what you want to do. No clutch, no wear (of course there's always some but you get what I mean).

Hit up the YouTube for some vids on blipping on a bike. Then go out and TRY IT. Might take a while to get it down but it's worth it. I was gumby at downshifting at first so I went back to clutching it on downshifts. When I finally got around to trying again I realised last time I had the timing wrong. Now it's a piece of piss.

 

[AUDACIA]

I was wondering.... how many of you practice rev matching when you downshift on your bikes? I know it isn't an essential unless you're tracking, but I love the exhaust note and it theoretically minimizes the wear on the clutch.

Plus it makes riding the twisties that much more fun

Thoughts?

I only rev match on turns otherwise I just go.

 

[spooph]

I tend to rev-match all the time... I don't know why, I guess just because it's fun and I like having power available all the time:
YouTube - Brake/Throttle and clutch cam on a Kawi 250R

You can rev-match with or without the clutch, being that it happens so fast on these bikes... I'd use the clutch while you're learning, because it's a lot more twitchy without the clutch. I generally don't clutchless-shift between 1-2 or 2-3 while shifting to a higher gear, but after that depending on how lazy my left hand is I'll clutchless-shift or not, usually always rev matching....

Your next question might be how does one learn to do it? Well, with the clutch it's pretty easy. Without the clutch, rolling down the road in 4th gear doing about 50mph, rest your left foot on the shifting pedal with just a bit of pressure, then just roll of the throttle and the shifter should slide into 3rd with a little bit of a jerk. Then you can play with timing and get it figured out. The bigger the difference in RPM's between gears, the greater your throttle input will be between gear shifts. Hope that makes sense.

 

[Blue Ghost]

It's gotten to be a habit. Gears can be a little sticky every once in a while. It seems to make the gear change a little bit smoother for me.

 

[jtgrenier]

I'm by no means an expert, so I'm soaking up as much of this as I can, but I can't help but think: If I'm trying to clutchlessly downshift to engine brake to a slower speed, wouldn't the ride get pretty jerky if I'm constantly rolling the throttle, downshifting, engine braking, rolling on throttle, downshifting, engine braking... etc? Because don't you then accelerate, downshift, decelerate, accelerate, downshift, decelerate...

Maybe it's just my mind that isn't working - I haven't been getting much sleep. lol I was just using the clutch because it makes sense that I would pull the clutch in to take the power away from the wheel, increase the revs, and return power to the wheel after downshifting to a lower gear.

 

[CoinSlot]

take the power away from the wheel, increase the revs, and return power to the wheel after downshifting to a lower gear.

This happens on a clutch-less shift, just faster.

 

[CoinSlot]

Just like Spooph, I decided to make a video today. Just the throttle side.

http://vimeo.com/21542883

 

[Felix]

Just like Spooph, I decided to make a video today. Just the throttle side.

I know where you live

That stretch of Hawksbury Rd and that bit of Moggill down to the ferry were the first places I topped out my cars

Felix

 

[jtgrenier]

Thanks for the vids! You guys seem to be pretty smooth with rev-matched downshifting.

I'm going to hold off on the clutchless downshifting. From what I've read, costly breakage can happen if I screw it up... But I'll tinker around with the clutchless upshifting sometime. I've already done it a couple times but nothing intensive.

 

[CoinSlot]

Thanks for the vids! You guys seem to be pretty smooth with rev-matched downshifting.

From practice!

Best way to practice is to do (almost) what Spooph said. Here's my take for the downshifts:

Find a nice big hill and get yourself to the top. Go down the hill and get up to 4th. Get OFF the throttle and engine break. While you're engine breaking put a bit of pressure on the shifter (the gearbox is loaded up, it won't go anywhere).
Now you want to blip the throttle and push on the shifter a little harder at the same time. When I say blip I mean a quick twist of the wrist and return the throttle to zero.
You will now be down one gear and once again engine breaking down the hill. Time for another blip and downshift!

It really is that easy and it happens very smoothly if you follow those directions. In my opinion it is easier to get the downshifts correct. As long as you do it while engine breaking.

If, for example, you are coming up to a hill and need to downshift for some extra revs then it becomes easier to get wrong. Even I will use the clutch in those situations sometimes.

 

[spooph]

Yup, all good advice! Practice makes perfect!

 

[Aysee]

I always blip on downshifts and I always use the clutch. It's fun.

 

[jtgrenier]

I took the bike to class today (I'm at IU, for anyone that cares) and decided to give the clutchless shifting a whirl. So far I've found that I'm actually smoother with the downshifting than I am with the upshifting. When I shift up the bike gets all jerky on me (in the lower gears, it's better about it in the higher gears (4?,5,6)). Is that just a timing issue? I noticed it wasn't quite so bad if I let off the throttle for a bit longer than usual... but then the shifts are actually SLOWER than if I were using the clutch.

What am I doing wrong?

 

[CoinSlot]

Upshifts:

Make sure you pre-load the shifter. Put some upwards pressure on it before you need to shift.
At the point you're ready to shift you need to quickly let off the throttle and jump back on it. You don't have to let the throttle all the way back to zero either, just a little bit.
The easiest way to practice upshifts is going full tilt. Hammer 2nd gear up towards redline and just before it gets there (with your shifter pre-loaded) quickly snap your wrist forward and back. At angry pace like this there is no finesse required. Just bang it in to the next gear.

It's at lower speeds and lower rates of acceleration where you will mess up the upshifts. This can only be fixed by practicing. The shifter needs varying degrees of both speed and strength to do smooth shifts when putting around.

Hope that helps. I'm super happy that you are actually going out and trying it.

 

[jtgrenier]

Upshifts:

Make sure you pre-load the shifter. Put some upwards pressure on it before you need to shift.
At the point you're ready to shift you need to quickly let off the throttle and jump back on it. You don't have to let the throttle all the way back to zero either, just a little bit.
The easiest way to practice upshifts is going full tilt. Hammer 2nd gear up towards redline and just before it gets there (with your shifter pre-loaded) quickly snap your wrist forward and back. At angry pace like this there is no finesse required. Just bang it in to the next gear.

It's at lower speeds and lower rates of acceleration where you will mess up the upshifts. This can only be fixed by practicing. The shifter needs varying degrees of both speed and strength to do smooth shifts when putting around.

Hope that helps. I'm super happy that you are actually going out and trying it.

Alright that makes sense. I'll try it again next ride. Thanks CoinSlot! I'll try to do you proud ;D;D lol

 

[jtgrenier]

I tried it again today (the up-shifting I mean). It's still a little jerkilicious but better. I think I just need more practice to tinker with the timing. But I've integrated the clutchless downshifting into my riding routine now 8).

I have one problem though. I can't seem to reach the front brake AND flick the throttle at the same time... I'm not use to having this type of issue because I have big hands! lol

Is it easy to adjust?