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post #21 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 04:34 AM
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And learning to ride on a bike thats under powered will not educate you how to ride on a bike that has accelration. I didnt say that a small bike is a bad thing but is nothing like riding a actual super sport. Riding dirt is nothing like the street at all except you are riding with hand controls. But it does help reflexes. A 650r is still not like a super sport. But to say that a 600 will kill you in two weeks is crap. Total crap. Thats like saying the gun kills ppl. You can say youve been racing a riding for years and some of you points are valid but telling ppl they will die is a crap think to say and you should check that crap. Yes my first bike was a zx10r. I rode a ninja 500 twice before i then i switched a r1. Then to a zx9 then a gsxr1000 then to a gsxr600 then to a r1 then to a 1300 then a zx9 again and then went to a r6 all the while having a few cruisers in the mix. You can over ride your abilities on all bikes. And for the comment about starting on a 650. The smaller bikes dont get respected and infact get ridden harder in the throttle Than the bigger bikes that are respected. You all can try to say all you want about the bikes being ridden harder cuz they cant keep up but thats crap too becausei know several guys who race250's but ride 600's. and they can probably kick everyones but in the curves on their 250. I ride alot. Over 100000 miles a year on bikes. Both on and off track. From 600's to 1000 to a full on ama bike. And when nicky is in town i get to ride the ducati factory bikes. Say what u want but if you have never been on multiple class bikes i dont see how you can have an opinion for all bike classes

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post #22 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 11:06 AM
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I stopped into my bike shop the other day when pieces of a ninja 300 were be in brought in. Bike had 11 miles on it when an extremely experienced driver expirienced several problems coming into a bridge. 1. Too fast for corner. 2. Overconfidence.3. Some sand and gravel on the curb side . 4. Etc etc etc.
He's been riding for years and everything from dirt bikes to sport bikes and touring . All I know is at my very inexperienced skill level the 300 is alllllll I need for now. It does what I need it to do and that's what matters to me. If a time comes when it doesn't then Ill get something different.

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post #23 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 11:15 AM
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post #24 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vortex
I stopped into my bike shop the other day when pieces of a ninja 300 were be in brought in. Bike had 11 miles on it when an extremely experienced driver expirienced several problems coming into a bridge. 1. Too fast for corner. 2. Overconfidence.3. Some sand and gravel on the curb side . 4. Etc etc etc.
He's been riding for years and everything from dirt bikes to sport bikes and touring . All I know is at my very inexperienced skill level the 300 is alllllll I need for now. It does what I need it to do and that's what matters to me. If a time comes when it doesn't then Ill get something different.
The 300 is not a bad bike and for some ppl thats all the will ever need and own. Im not knocking that at all. Just the hex/curse statement that getting a bigger bike will kill you. And as for the guy who wrecked. All bikes can be ridden in a way that causes accidents wether that being to fast, improper braking, or improper driving techniques while turning which many ppl do wrong. At least half. But. Any biker at any skill level can wreck with sand on the road on straights and turns. So if he over shot the turn and that pushed him over into sand and caused a wreck. It again wasnt the bike but the rider. Not the gun!!!! Whatever bike you chose to ride. Enjoy it. Dont just go to msf actually learn your bike and learn proper riding techniques. Plenty of riding school around the nation to teach things you probably wont pick up on without someone else. Telling you or showing you. But either way. Stay safe and enjoy the road

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post #25 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 12:50 PM
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Thumbs up

that's a fact to

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post #26 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 01:01 PM
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I couldn't agree more. Which is a little hypocritical of me because I started on a 650r a year and a half ago and still ride it to this day. But looking back, it was a dumb decision. I wasn't very educated about how much power a 650 class bike had. Yes, I did wreck it in the first month and that could have been avoided by having a lighter and better handling bike. Even though I was not at fault in the accident, it still could have been avoided with more seasoned riding skills on my part. I'm lucky I didn't get hurt on that thing. Just an accidental unexpected jerk of the throttle can get you in trouble in a hurry. I may have survived starting on a 650 but there have been many people out there who haven't. Today, I am completely comfortable with the bike. But, no matter what some may believe, most people are tempted to push their "limits" when they first begin to ride because its a new life experience and the thrill of riding fast can be tempting to anyone who loves riding motorcycles whether they are a noob or a veteran.
Thanks. It does carry more weight when it comes from someone that started on a middle-weight and felt they might have made a better choice starting on something smaller.


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post #27 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 01:19 PM
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And learning to ride on a bike thats under powered will not educate you how to ride on a bike that has accelration. I didnt say that a small bike is a bad thing but is nothing like riding a actual super sport. Riding dirt is nothing like the street at all except you are riding with hand controls. But it does help reflexes. A 650r is still not like a super sport. But to say that a 600 will kill you in two weeks is crap. Total crap. Thats like saying the gun kills ppl. You can say youve been racing a riding for years and some of you points are valid but telling ppl they will die is a crap think to say and you should check that crap. Yes my first bike was a zx10r. I rode a ninja 500 twice before i then i switched a r1. Then to a zx9 then a gsxr1000 then to a gsxr600 then to a r1 then to a 1300 then a zx9 again and then went to a r6 all the while having a few cruisers in the mix. You can over ride your abilities on all bikes. And for the comment about starting on a 650. The smaller bikes dont get respected and infact get ridden harder in the throttle Than the bigger bikes that are respected. You all can try to say all you want about the bikes being ridden harder cuz they cant keep up but thats crap too becausei know several guys who race250's but ride 600's. and they can probably kick everyones but in the curves on their 250. I ride alot. Over 100000 miles a year on bikes. Both on and off track. From 600's to 1000 to a full on ama bike. And when nicky is in town i get to ride the ducati factory bikes. Say what u want but if you have never been on multiple class bikes i dont see how you can have an opinion for all bike classes
You're telling me you suggest a 600 or more for a new rider that wants to go fast, but you don't expect them to exceed their limits - NO WAY!

Poor technique is poor technique - no matter what size bike you ride - but learning proper technique is easier on a smaller/lighter cycle.

As far as dirt bike riding not directly relating to street riding, I think you are wrong. It's an easy way to learn to operate the controls in a manageable environment. Dirt riding teaches you to control a cycle that has limited traction, and needs constant correction. While that doesn't happen that often on the street, if it does, you will have the skills to react - there's no time to think about it.

What is this "respected" you're talking about?

Starting on a 1000 was fine for you - some people can do it successfully - but not many. Just because you did it doesn't make it a good idea.

Speaking of guns...As a former Range Officer and firearms instructor I can draw a few parallels. I've trained hundreds of adults and junior olympic shooters, some that have become National Champions. When teaching someone to shoot, I would never hand them a .45. I prefer to start new shooters with airguns. The basics are much easier to learn and comprehend when the task they are learning is simplified. After they have proven to be proficient with an airgun they can then learn to manage some amount of recoil - but I'm still not going to hand them a .45 Hardball gun. The proper basic techniques don't change, but there are more variables to manage. When they learn the proper techniques from the start it will be easy to apply them later.

As you learn a skill you can progress upward into managing more variables (speed, recoil, etc). But when you are first learning a new skill you can easily become overwhelmed and make critical mistake. Learning on a smaller cycle (or gun) will eliminate the amount and severity of the mistakes, and will increase your skill level quicker and safer.


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post #28 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 02:28 PM
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I agree that you can make mistakes on a bike but learning on a bike that you wont respect will get you in trouble regardless of size. Jay what is it that you arent the best in?your a big time racer your a national and olympic training range officer and a load of shit. Respect the bike you have. Ride it knowing that you can get hurt easily if you ride it outside your ability. And as far as guns go you can say what you want but guns dont pull the trigger nor do bikes twist the throttle. You say youve been riding for years and years. If thats the case then you should be able to know better. They have plenty of newbs on this forum that apparently can do what you say is impossible. Are they just the elite few? I doubt it. Its called riding smart. And yes if you want a fastbike you dont get a small bike. You will be pissed. Which is in fact what i said. And as far as dirt goes. I didnt diasgree with you totally but dirt bikes handle different all together. Yes i ride both so dont bother asking. So do many of your racers in the off season to include rossi lorenzo and many many others to improve reflexes but not to get the feel of a street bike per say. Any rider can get hurt including myself if i dont respect the bike im on wether it be a 250 or a 1400. Ive actually done this very thing on a 125 because i was not in the mindset to ride the bike to its capability. I tried to push the bike too hard with the mindset that the bike if pushed harder withless power that it could take it. Sure i was the fastest out on the track that day but once i crashed it. I got back up rode it again and found the bike had limits that my abilities exceeded. Many riders will never truly have this happen. But my point being respect doesnt have to be on just big bikes. But the bike has to be respected so that you ride to your potential and not over it as well as the bikes potentials. You can learn techniques on a big bike as you can a small one. And yes sometimes a bigger bike can get away from those who arent informed to what decision they make. But throughout all of these messages you still havent caught on to whats been said. Any bike can hurt anyone. Regardless of ones personal skill level.
My riding group has nearly 2500 members in it and we ride monthly together. Everything from 250's to 1400 with nos. We have seminars given by race instructors, motorcycle cops, stunt riders, and motivational speakers once every 6 months. All to raise awareness of riding. We have a annual gathering every year, in the next state over, with over 35000 bikers in two days, bikes of all kinds to promote fellowship among bikers and share stories etc. im not the best snowboarder. Nor the best shooter on the range nor the best at many things but when it comes to bikes. Im one of the best. Ive ridden with guys like lorenzo. Rossi, hayden , spies. On the track and I think you should watch comments like you say. Getting a 600 you will die in two weeks. Thats an ass statement and shouldnt be said the way you said it. Ive attache a few pics of how many i ride with on a typical ride with when on the street. For yall to see
Attached Images
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post #29 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 03:29 PM
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I'm brand spanking new to riding at 46 years old having never ride a quad or dirt bike. I believe there is a reason in my msf course that all if us were on small 250's. just my newbie opinion.

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post #30 of 86 Old 07-01-2013, 03:36 PM
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There is. Thats because most super sport riders wont attend one. I dis agree with it but it is what it is

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